June 30, 2021

Season 2, Episode 19

Season 2, Episode 19

Gil and Eric are joined by Fan and friend of the show Erin, in a flip the script show, where Erin asks us the questions she would like more answers to.  Nothing is off limits.  Erin is also an accomplished Tarot card reader and read cards for us during the episode.  Erin's business is Hermit and The Moon and can be found at:

Instagram
Facebook

*******Trigger Warning********

This episode discusses sexual assault and molestation from about minute 25-minute 38, so feel free to fast forward if needed.

Transcript
Eric:

Hello, welcome to the Q lounge. The following episode contains discussion of sexual assault and molestation from about the 25 minute mark to the 38 minute mark. So please feel free to fast forward thank you. Hello, and welcome to The Q Lounge Podcast. I'm Eric and I'm Gil. Join us as we discuss news stories and life situations. As they relate to the LGBTQIA plus experience, please visit us at theQloungepodcast.com and hit that subscribe button or listen wherever you get your podcasts while you're there. Please leave us a five star review and don't forget to tell your friends Hello and welcome to the Q lounge. I'm Eric I'm Gil. And today we are honored to be joined by a fan of the show, a friend of the show. Erin Thank you Erin so much for joining us. Just so everyone knows we're going to do things a little bit differently today. We're going to flip the script and Erin is actually going to interview us and talk to us and see what things she wants answered that she thinks maybe we haven't covered enough of or haven't delve deep enough into. We will go with that, but just a couple quick things. We will be on hiatus after this episode, so we will be on about a two month hiatus. So you won't have us for July and August we're sad, but you'll have us back in September. Yay. Yes. And also remember to check us out at theqloungepodcast.com. You can check out our Instagram and Twitter and Facebook @TheQLounge. Also check out our swag at the, on the store icon. Tell your friends, leave us a review, Preferably a five star and. Yeah, I think that's mainly most of that. A couple of things I wanted to talk to you guys about though. Carl, Nassib the defensive end for the Las Vegas Raiders. Now I don't want to say Oakland. just came out as gay. He's the first active NFL player come out as gay. So I think that's awesome. And I have a little bit of mixed feelings on it, but for the most part, I think it's really awesome. He came out in an Instagram posts, basically stating that he had something to say that he's gay and he's a very private person. He's not doing it for attention, but he thinks the visibility is important. Yeah. And he donated a hundred thousand dollars for the Trevor project, which is amazing because if you don't know what the Trevor project is, they are the leading organization for troubled youth and the LGBTQ community. They help with suicide prevention and all that other stuff. So Trevor project is an amazing organization. And thank you, Carl for that. What did you guys think about him coming out?

Erin:

It's good. This is news to me. It's the first time I'm hearing of it.

Gil:

Yeah, I was going to say it's neat, especially in a very macho, the NFL and any of the really big any of the Northern north American sports it's needed. It's just one of those. I agree. I'm shocked that we haven't had more gays out already, but

Eric:

yeah, but again, it's that toxic masculine environment. You're going to be scared, which kind of goes into what we talked about last week. That, even though like you're a celebrity or whatever, you still have to be careful with who you tell and when you tell, so I think it's great that we have that visibility. My only issue with it, and it's not really an issue with it. It's not an issue with him at all is I don't want people to look at that as like a martyr kind of situation or oh, he's making it okay for gay people will know. It's all, like Gil said in our last episode, it's the people who look different. It's the feminine guys, it's the drag Queens. It's the transgender community that have made it, what it is so that we fight. So they've made it comfortable enough for him to be able to come out and for the correct quote, unquote masc or straight hetero passing gays to come out. So that's my only issue as that, like I said, it's not an issue with him. I think it's fantastic. Hopefully this will lead to more. professional athletes coming out

Gil:

to keep them, or, like it's

Eric:

The Raiders did tweet Their support. Like they were super proud of him. He's already signed a three-year contract. Yeah. Cause I don't

Gil:

want to make sure that someone, not one of those. Oh my God. I'm so glad you're out of proud. And all of a sudden this contract

Eric:

gets cut. I thought about that too. And I hope you don't have these asshole guys that are like, I'll take them out. Exactly. That's also a fear, but he's a defensive end. So he's a pretty powerful dude. Yeah,

Gil:

no,

Eric:

he's not the kicker, which I loved kickers. I love kickers, but they're typically thinner and they have less protection in padding, poor

Gil:

things.

Eric:

They're always the first ones cut too. So he missed one field goal and they get cut. You have a quarterback who throw 17 interceptions and they don't. Huh?

Erin:

I feel like they're not invited to the parties.

Eric:

I'm just, yeah. I don't think they are either. So did you guys hear about Britney Spears today?

Gil:

I did not until you

Eric:

okay. So everyone knows about the free Britney thing. That's going on. We've talked about. In depth on this podcast as well. Yeah. So apparently she actually testified today via phone for over 20 minutes. Like begging them to end the conservatorship because she has absolutely no rights. She's been hurt tremendously. Her family has hurt her tremendously. Yeah. She is not allowed to get married. She's not allowed to have kids. She's not allowed to be in her boyfriend's car without a chaperone has an IUD in her that she can not have removed to make sure that she doesn't get pregnant. She was committed into a mental health facility against her will and put on lithium against her will due to this conservatorship. I think that's disgusting. I think it's gross. Yeah. I can't believe this country is allowed to dictate to women what they can do with their lives and their bodies. And we all stand with women on the show and I'm just floored because she is a woman of power. She's, her name is a big name. She has power and she's still being treated like this. So I just hashtag free Britney, where we stand with you, Britney. I tagged the ACLU in a tweet earlier tonight asking where are you during the Britney Spears? Because that's your job to make sure that people's rights aren't violated and that yeah. Maybe something will come from that. On a lighter note today is June 23rd. So I know this isn't going to drop until June 30th, but today's June 23rd when we're recording and today is national suck a Dick day

Erin:

appropriate to record a

Eric:

podcast. Yeah. I'm a little behind on that. The one day we skipped, I know the one day I put my knee pads up. So with that said we'll turn this over to you want to hear something funny though? Cause you're doing your tarot cards. I thought you were putting lotion on your hands this whole time. And I was like, wow, that's a lot of lotion. And then I just now snap that it was your tarot card. Yes. Erin is going to do a tarot reading for us. Yes.

Erin:

That's how I feel like I should start because that's what I do. It's my jam. So I'm just gonna do like a few basic cards for basic questions and pull a card for each of us. And I can talk a little bit about it. Okay. So to start, we're just going to start with the question, what is showing up here and now in the present moment, and I'm going to pull a card for Eric first. Oh, okay. Oh my God. This is so beautiful. All right. So the king of cups, I'll show you guys it since you.

Eric:

Cool. Awesome. That's a beautiful card. Sorry, you guys can't see it on the other side of the podcast, but it's a beautiful card.

Erin:

Sure. Podcasts. listeners. I guess that's not how it works. So the king of cups is like the healer of all healers. And I feel this has been such a healing experience, listening to you podcast and witnessing, what's come up for you and your self healing and you're bringing other people into healing. So I feel like that makes a lot of sense for the present moment.

Eric:

Thank you. I'm going to get, teary-eyed already

Gil:

like six

Eric:

minutes. I know. And I'm already crying. Oh

Erin:

my God. And I love that's coming up in the present moment. I feel like it's setting the stage for a healing reading and healing podcast and just a healing experience all around. So same question what's showing up in the present moment for Gil and I'm using a different deck because that's what I was called to do. Ooh. Eight of Pentacles. This is a really cool card.

Eric:

Oh, nice. I like that. Oh, it's all

Gil:

masc, all butch

Erin:

The eight of Pentacles is all about evolutionary practice. So growth through staying dedicated to your practice. And that can come in any form. Physical practice, like practicing a certain skill as it shows up in the car, that's usually how it's depicted, but it's really about anything. So if you're practicing, being a new version of yourself that kind of thing and I love the eights because they're really evolutionary. So they're you step into the energy one way and you leave changed. Okay. So I feel like maybe you're going to be stepping into this podcast one way and leaving changed. Yeah, I like it. Yeah. Yeah. And then I'm going to just pull one for me, just for

Eric:

fun. I love your hair by the way, is it? Yeah, it's a lot going on here.

Erin:

Oh, I got two of cups. Look at that.

Eric:

Oh, that's beautiful. I love that one. What deck is that? I love that deck.

Erin:

Yes, that is so good. It's called. This might hurt tarot. And it's two boys, as you can see, which is lovely for this podcast. I feel the right card. Thanks cards. The two of cups is really interesting. It's, it's often the old paradigm is A relationship, mostly depicted that way. So a lot of people read that card like that. It's in regards to our relationship and in soul tarot, which is what I study and learn from Lindsay Mack. Who's amazing. She reframes it as self-love, so really embracing those qualities that you adore and others and finding them within yourself. As much as there might be a quality that I adore in someone else, there's someone else who adores that same quality in me. So I really like love that card. It's

Eric:

great. Awesome. Yeah. Okay.

Erin:

And then I'm going to pull one card, one more card. Just as an anchor for the reading or, an anchor for the podcast so that we can all lean on and I'll use that deck since you loved it. So this one will be for all of us in our discussion together. Okay. Oh, seven of Pentacles. And this one's all about Patience which I love. I feel like sometimes you want to rush through, or you don't take time to just take a breath and you feel like you need to fill the space and you're rushing the fruits of your labor. And I feel like that's a great anchor card for us to work with. That's

Eric:

awesome. And that's definitely something I have to work on all the time. I'm super impatient. I

Erin:

think what's coming through to me specifically, especially in this is like really leaving that space for. There to be pauses before answering. I think that's a little bit hard in a podcast setting cause, but I'm assuming, people will get the gist. And I also often when I listen to podcasts, I like hearing somebody like breathe before they answer, I know that means they're taking that sort of sacred moment to really deepen into their answer and not just throw it out there.

Eric:

Yeah.

Erin:

That makes sense. Okay. So that's the tarot reading section. Do either of you guys have a question for the cards that you want me to pull a card or we could maybe do one another one at the end totally up to you.

Eric:

I think let's do one at the end. Okay, cool.

Erin:

Yeah, I think that's it. Okay. So my first question, I've listened to every episode I'm going to start there every single one. And obviously you two are typically the interviewers on the podcast and you ask the challenging questions and allow your guests, the space to bring authenticity and vulnerability around their stories. So I'd love to ask you to share your personal stories. What has shaped you, what inevitable childhood teenagehood and adulthood traumas are you healing from currently and what is your relationship to self care and self tending?

Eric:

I'll let you take this first.

Gil:

Oh God, this is loaded. I have to drink

Eric:

a little bit.

Gil:

I know let's cheers real quick. Okay. Let's dissect this question.

So

Erin:

what has shaped who you

Gil:

are? Oh God. I, oh God, this is gonna be interesting. I think it's going to be a mix of obviously families could be portion of it. And I think that definitely my childhood coming from a biracial family. Me, me a mixed kid, especially when others were very, homogenous, I guess is the best way to put it. And I was the only one in my growing up in school and stuff like that. So it was very different and culturally, my families were similar, but not. So there was that, having a balance and Teeter kind of between who shaped me. And then. Became more comfortable with myself for realization of who the real Gil is of being a, gay, proud male later, then it was like that reinvention again. And then that's when I was starting to choose my own families. So my friends started having that influence on, my development and who I eventually will become and in mashing it together. And then forming finally in my mid twenties, I think is when I really took shape and lead. Okay. Hot mess has done every, in all the brooding, depression and emo Nez and everything settled. And then I feel like since my probably mid twenties I've shaped into me in a very comfortable way. I love that. Yeah.

Erin:

Do you feel like with your friends, I'm just going to ask a follow-up question because this is how it's going to roll, do you feel like. You talked about chosen family, which I think, soul family, chosen family is such a different experience than the family were born into. Do you feel like within that chosen family, you were an influencer or highly influenced by others? Like where did you feel you fit into

Gil:

that? I think I, an oddly ended up influencing as I, the base built. So I had, I got influenced by actually Eric and that's why, like that, it's the person who I actually learned a lot of the wisdoms and the ways and, stuff like that, but I took that knowledge and somehow it became mother hen to a lot of it and they would gravitate towards me for whatever reason. And then I started branching off my knowledge to them or, things that I've learned. And then I ended up influencing like the group. And it's all rural. And I, I never asked for, because if you would have met me growing up, you're like, oh, that kid's pretty quiet. He sticks to himself. He's middle, down, vanilla down the middle here. It's nothing to him, but it ended up having a lot more influence as I got older and chose my, with the chosen group. Yeah. I was, I'm less getting influenced, but Eric was the big one.

Erin:

I love that. I

Eric:

know I'm all like red now. What was my wisdom then? So

Erin:

I love that. I feel like that's really, it feels very evolutionary. When we pulled a eight card at the beginning for you, and it's just interesting how it's

Gil:

all right. It's perfect. Yeah.

Erin:

And then, you know what, or I don't know if you feel like talking about any sort of traumas that you're currently healing from or have healed from,

Gil:

I act actually came out yesterday when you talking about actually the trauma that you know, and I can't really speak too much on the details of what was asked, but I was part of some legal situations thinking at work or I had I was called upon to speak about, and, a year ago, some things were happening at my place of employment. And there's a lot of verbal abuse from protestings and stuff like that happening. And they were saying certain words and, at the time dealing with it, I was like, oh, I'm fine. And blah, blah, blah. Come hold your composure. But when I really spoke about it, I didn't realize how much of the trauma of the using the word faggot. Directed at me continuously started opening up wounds from childhood, from other kids, and like I said, I could deal with the racial stuff. I dealt with a lot of, things I heard, but that word in particular is one that triggered me. And I didn't realize it that bad until it came out, rushing in. And I was actually in, I, the Eric, I don't cry. I don't sit there. I was, I sit there, see, what's sitting in the law office, bawling, crying, and it took me a while to pull my composure back together because that's not me. I'm like, who are you? What's going on? But that's a traumatic for me, that kind of had some bullies growing up and I don't really talk about it. Cause my confidence I'm like, no, I can handle this. I can take them on, but it was terrifying. And it started coming back again and I'm like, I'm in my mid thirties. I shouldn't be like that.

Eric:

It's interesting how those triggers work. And it's interesting how the body mentally and emotionally will just pack that shit into latency to protect you. Correct. And then at some point, and that we do talk about that a lot in Asian medicine about like with the whole luo system, just your body packs, all that shit into latency and just like uses whatever substance it can to hold it there. Usually blood. Yeah. And then at some point, though, it's going to explode and over full fill and you have to empty those luos. Also one of my favorite quotes is you can only dust or under the rug for so long before you choke.

Gil:

Yeah. So that was one of those weird traumatic things that came back and is that for sure on expected? I, it just did not. Yeah.

Erin:

So I feel like. How do you feel like your heat? Like how do you feel like you're healing from that? I know we often, I feel like in this culture and in this country and in this, like I don't generation don't leave a lot of space for grieving. Those kinds of things. It sounds like you're, you were forced into some grief.

Gil:

Yes.

Erin:

Happens and spills over because we don't make space for that.

Gil:

Yeah. And I think especially someone, my cultural upbringing, it's very, hold your composure. You want to look stronger than you are, it's that don't. They'll let them bully you. You're never going to submit to them, you're the winner. You're going to fight till the end. So a lot of it's the words did impact me or the cut deeper than I expected. Yeah. And I think it's just even the saying it, try to give it, reclaiming, has been the big thing in the last year, with certain words, but that's a word for me. That's so it's just vile, but I'm trying to reclaim, but I say it I'm like, Ugh, start crying later equals

Eric:

liberation. It does.

Erin:

Wow. That's powerful. How do you feel like do you feel like you are a person in your family that's healing some of those legacies? I know you said you were set up to not show emotion or to, be strong or power through, or don't let people mistreat you. Are you, do you feel like you're taking on the role of potentially a person who can do some healing around that legacy, both, past and future

Gil:

try to yes. Yeah. Yeah. It's work in progress with that.

Erin:

Even just by being able to talk about it, I think it's important to recognize how that heals your sort of ancestral lineage, when you to heal yourself you're healing way beyond just your own self, yeah. And

Gil:

it's a lot of weight that's, like when I came out, I'm sure you felt like that with Eric. It just like that huge sigh of relief in, all that burden and the same thing with this, it's okay. Yeah.

Erin:

And then I feel like the last one was, what's your relationship to self care and self tending. And I think that's a perfect sort of follow up to that. What do you do to care for yourself when you have those kinds of experiences?

Gil:

Oh like shopping, no Def I've learned. Yeah. I've learned to talk it out or to be a little bit more exposed with my emotions. I know my husband will probably disagree, in my way, I've learned how to even just say, Hey, I was hurt. I did, I didn't even like yesterday I called him. I'm like, I'm vulnerable right now. I am not in a good space. I need to center myself in, I said, this is what kind of happened. And it's very open in the very, like I said, he would never ever before. But I've learned how to just speak about it a little bit more if I'm not, if something's just not jelling about it. And normally for me, I try to work also with my, I dunno, it's therapeutic, but more like skincare. Yeah. You gotta call my I'm like, okay. But some low shit scrub my face. Just like my body. Cause I tend to go if I'm stressing, I'm eating, not good food. I'm sitting down, I'm going to, it's almost like my whole system shuts down and then I'm like, oh, I gained 15 pounds. Why am I shocked? And I realized I had to start moving exercise. Some basic things, I don't know this thing positive.

Erin:

I feel like self-care is really autonomous. And so I can, people often think of the standard sort of capitalistic that people approach self care, but I really liked what you said about, just To standing up for yourself and that's

Gil:

self-care yeah. Yeah, it is. Thank you. good question.

Erin:

All right let's shift over to Eric. Same thing.

Eric:

Do we have to, oh yeah.

Erin:

Basically just asking if you'd like to share any specific personal stories, since you're always the ones having folks share them with you and starting out with, what has shaped, who you are.

Eric:

Okay. I don't mean to laugh. When I get really uncomfortable, I laughed. It's gonna be a lot of laughing right now. Yeah, so I, how am I going to say this? Okay. So I come from a Latin X family. So I was raised a lot with the machismo attitude and the whole toxic masculine attitude. I will say thankfully I was raised by an awesome mother who was a very powerful and assertive woman, and she's very like equal rights for everybody. So I'm lucky with that. But I have a couple uncles who are very toxic, masculine people. I don't talk to and I don't talk to any of them. One of them has passed away actually, but they were very much. Anti-gay they would make comments about gay people. My other uncle, their oldest brother is gay and they would deal with him because he's their brother, but they didn't like him. They would make comments about him. They made snide comments to me as a child about him. So I just, that was just enforced and then reinforced into my head. And then again, coming from the Latin community where it's also looked down upon typically. Yeah. So that was that as far as. That's concerned. I also don't know my biological father, so there's that I don't know, honestly, it's abandonment issues, but there's like this unsure unresolved issue there. I've resolved it for myself as of lately within the last like year and a half maybe. Yeah. Let's see. I went to a Christian high school and there was a lot of that attitude that gay is wrong. Look in the Bible. And I wasn't even out, I didn't even question my sexuality at that point. I think I was, I probably knew, but I think I was probably so scared to even think that was a part of my life that I was like no.

Erin:

It sounds like that was reinforced in like all of your, sort of outside circles, both family than

Eric:

school. Yeah. So there was that. And then I'm gonna get a drink really quick. Okay. I'm a survivor of sexual assault and sexual molestation, child molestation. And so I guess from the ages of five to about seven, there was one specific person who committed the acts. I didn't say anything. No one knew about it until I was 13. Cause I was having like tons of nightmares all the time and I couldn't sleep and it was manifesting itself. Demonic possession. Wow. And it was for like, I want to say eight months, I was just having these constant nightmares until I was actually able to tell somebody. But I've had just in my childhood before turning 21, I've probably have five or six different assailants. Wow. So there was that person from five to seven, and then there was another person from seven to eight who, and this is going to be really weird for me to say, it's going to be really hard for me to say because I had to come with, I had to come to terms with this probably about eight to 10 years ago. That person was the first person who introduced me to Janet Jackson music. Oh, that's a hard. So every time I hear Janet music. I'm triggered back to that, but I have such a love for Janet. So it was like this weird balance for me for a while. And then I finally had to like, just dive in and tackle it. I also had three other people, two or two were women, two are female and three were male that up until I was probably like, I want to say into my early teens, I at one point, and I'm still trying to figure this out at one point, I feel like it was because it was so familiar to me that I actually like almost asked for it or craved it. I don't know if that makes any sense. It definitely does.

Erin:

It's like when we think about how we've experienced sort of love, right? Get out whether it's healthy or not healthy. Cause we don't really know the difference, especially.

Eric:

And I think that's when yeah, like I think that's one reason now I was very sexualized as a child and I think that's one reason why I have a very overly sexual personality now. Cause like you said, that's how you show your love or that's how you think people want you to show your love to them. It's also though, not that it was ever a good thing. Like I think that's a terrible situation across the board, but it's made me like, like I am so like against rape and molestation and sexual assault because of that. That's one area in my life. There's probably a couple, but that's one main area where I actually become ultra conservative. Yeah. So like I'm super liberal. Oh yeah. Like all this other stuff, but when it comes to that type of stuff, I pretty much am like, yeah, give him the death penalty because you've literally just murdered someone's soul and their whole person. Yeah. That's where I become. That's where I become super conservative and I have absolutely no tolerance for that type of mindset, that type of humor, that type of anything that goes along with that stuff. Yeah, so there's that happened to me as a child. And as a teenager and I was like, it was weird cause I had blocked three of those situations out and I think it's because of the relationship to those situations, which I'm not going to get into. Cause I'm S I'm still in that like weird. Role mentally and emotionally where you don't want to out them. I don't know if that makes sense. I know I've heard other survivors talk about that too. Like you still put that you still have that shame and guilt on you that you're not, I don't know. So I was on a walk one day and all of a sudden, I just stopped in my tracks and I was like, holy fuck. My body has like really just suppressed so much trauma so that I can still be functioning and still be breathing and living. And then all of this stuff just started coming up and I was like, oh my God, I forgot about that. And I forgot about that and I forgot about it. And then the thing is I could almost go back to exactly like those situations and see those situations. If I was like reliving. On that walk. And it was like three of them all at once. And I was like, oh fuck. Like what the sh I was like completely. Yeah, it was really just traumatic again. Yeah. To go through that. It's traumatic to think about it too, but at the same time I actually, if they cry, it crosses my mind almost daily now, and I have to think about it and compartmentalize it and deal with it and push through it. But I don't push it to the side and try to go forward anymore. I look at it, study it and see how I can move forward. Also, I guess there's been a couple of other incidences after being 21 where I was drugged a couple of times and. Stuff happened. Sexual assault is bad, regardless. I know with 90% assurity that there was like not actual penetration that happened, but still me being taken advantage of sexually, because I was under some extreme influence that I had no idea about me being exposed in a club and all this other stuff. And then some other sexual acts with another situation. One of them actually just happened when I was like in my thirties. Yeah. I think those are some traumas that I'm healing with that have shaped my life. Yes.

Erin:

That's so I think there's something about sharing, like you said, that is both scary and also. Part of your healing, right? Absolutely.

Eric:

Yeah. Like I know I've made mention of it before in this podcast in a couple episodes. I haven't really talked in detail about it and I'm proud. I'm sure. I could go into a lot more detailed than I just did, but right now I'm not there to actually go into that detail. Yeah. I remember one time though, I was in therapy and my therapist made me write a letter to one of the people to the first person. Cause at the time that was like the only person I could actually think of. Like I couldn't, I didn't remember all the other situations. Cause again, like my body had blocked it out and then I guess I'd probably eight or eight to 10 years ago. I remembered the one and then. Those other three that just popped up, like what that was like within the last six months, like honestly And then the other, the later two, I've known about and just have done the stupid thing and pushed it aside. One of which is because like when the second one happened, I was like super days. I was still like super high from the night before. And I don't do drugs. Everyone knows that I've just never done that type of stuff typically. And I had to go to work and I was like completely anxious and frantic. And I was talking to other then friend of mine who was a counselor. And she basically put it back on me and was like, oh, it wasn't anything like you think it was because you had feelings for that person anyways. And it would have happened regardless if you, it sounds like

Erin:

she's had her own trauma.

Eric:

And so that never sat well with me. We did state remain friends for a while until she completely lied to me and I, she broke my trust and then we're just not friends anymore. But Going back to the, and she's actually the person who set me up with my therapist that I had. But my therapist made me write a letter. And so I did, but then I was like, after putting it down on paper, I'm like, this letter is not for me to say to this person. And this letter is for me to take ownership of myself again. Yeah. And so I was like, I don't want to read this letter. Yeah. I don't want to read this letter to this person. I'm not giving them that closure. I'm giving myself the closure. And so I'm identifying it for myself. And then after that, I just started writing down all my feelings and emotions every single week and handing them to her and she's oh my gosh. If all my patients wear this on it wow. And then also the song, what about by Janet Jackson? There's the full interlude, which I think is super important to go with the song. That song is about domestic violence and rape. At one point while I was seeing the therapist and that's my favorite song in the whole wide world, even though I don't really listen to it a whole lot, because it can be triggering for me. There was one point when I was seeing that therapist and I was like, this song is about me now. Like the song is no longer about this situation. This song is about me and the abuse I've put myself through and the allowances I've made to make it okay for these other people to have done this to me. And I'm just like taking ownership of who I am again. Yeah. Yeah I answer your question. Definitely.

Erin:

And I pulled a card while I was listening to you and it's the cups and the little sub is safety.

Eric:

I love that.

Erin:

I feel finding those pockets of safety for yourself to do your healing is really important. And also autonomous it's yours. You get to decide the pacing and, I know that we can spend a lot of time, beating ourselves up about shoulds and should nots and those just don't serve.

Eric:

No, I agree.

Erin:

Processing the way you process. That comes to the sort of in the same. Flow of questions, what is your relationship to self care and self tending? Like what types of things do you do, especially when you've had, either a triggering experience or, done some deep healing work? Like how do you tend to your yourself?

Eric:

So it used to be dance because I was a dancer. And I think also rewinding back. I think that's also shaped me into the fact that I'm typically like all or nothing kind of person and almost, not every aspect of my life, but most aspects of my life. So I go all in or I'm not in at all. So like when I was dancing, like it was very cathartic for me. It was very therapeutic for me because you learn how to control your body and move your body and your doing it. And then you learn how to trust your body to do what it needs to do. Even if you're doing other things or thinking about other things, your body still knows what it needs to do. So it's still, it's taking in power and ownership of your body again. So dance used to be super therapeutic for me until it wasn't. And then it became like an abusive relationship to me later. Yeah. We don't have to get into that. And then since dance, I had a little bit of a struggle. Exercise has always been really therapeutic for me. Like I know a lot people are like, oh, I go to the gym to work out and be pretty. And I've had, I've definitely had that mentality before too. And I've also had the whole I can't eat anything and I have to go do four hours of cardio to be skinny. I've had very disordered eating and borderline eating disorder. I have a bad relationship with food. And I think that also stems from all that trauma stuff that we just talked about as well, because I think I used it as a defense mechanism to oh, if I, even though like in my head, I wanted it to be like super thin and what society wants us to be. I think like my subconscious and myself was like, no, you don't want to be attractive because you want to keep people away from you because of all the shit that's happened. So that's taken me a lot to deal with. But like I love going to the gym. To me, the gym is fun. Like exercise to me is just like playing. It's just like being a kid and playing with toys and you're using gym equipment or like seeing what your body can do and testing it. So I really love the gym. I love yoga. So those have really helped me. Writing has been therapeutic for me for a long while. I used to blog a lot, which Gil can attest to my blogs and my poems there. And then I recently released my poetry book, which was just a lot of like thoughts and emotions,

Gil:

which you can get on Amazon.

Eric:

But you can get on Amazon a moment in a moment of death. So yeah now actually this podcast has been really healing for me. And I'm talking to people has been really healing with me because we're in this pandemic and I'm an introvert anyways. And I've said this many times, so the pandemic was like, my life hardly changed at all because I don't talk to people anyways, unless like I really care about people. I actually care about the person. Then I don't really talk to people because. I'm an introvert and I need my space in my alone time. But being able to connect with people on this podcast and hearing their stories has been really helpful and healing. Being able to offer the platform has been really healing for me as well. Cause I love to build people up. I started bike riding again, and that's been really healing because it just gives me some money alone time. Yeah. Walks Yeah. That's I guess that's my self-care regimen. I used to be a retail therapy kind of person, but I haven't been so much anymore. Possibly, cause I don't have the money to buy red bottoms, which the happiness is the same price as red bottoms, according to Ariana Grande's. So I

Erin:

think that there's some divestment from capitalism that we're all going through. If we have a school at all. So obviously you do. So it starts to become like, is that really doing anything for me?

Eric:

Yeah. Oh, one thing also, I want to say, oh,

Erin:

of how it sounds like most of your self tending is really grounded. Like grounding work, like grounding into your physical being. It's definitely something I struggle with. Like I'm really disconnected from my body most of the times. I feel like being connected to your body is such a get information,

Eric:

Yeah. Yeah. Like I'll say it's I've had an extensive background in physical fitness for a long time. I'm a certified exercise physiologist through the American college of sports medicine and doctor of Asian medicine. And so I deal a lot with the body. But was it like three, four years ago? No, it was actually longer than that. I think it was like five years ago now. I got really sick, like really sick. And I, as the doctors told me, I should have been dead or at least in a coma, but because I live such a healthy lifestyle, that's what kept me alive. But I remember I lost a lot of my motor function. Yeah. So luckily I was such a high level trained dancer in my area of dance. That's what I lost. So I was still able to walk, even though I still I stumbled and I shuffled my feet a little bit and I was stuttering and slurring my words all the time. I was still able to talk and communicate, and I was still able to walk and stand. I couldn't dance anymore. Like I still had rhythm, but I couldn't do execute movements. Once I got better I'm auto-immune so once I got better, I. Really trained hard to get my dancing skill back. And even though I'm not a dancer now I still practice some of it and still train it just because I know what it was like to not have it. Yeah.

Erin:

So do you think you're not a dancer or are you not a performer? Because I think those are two

Eric:

reasons. No, and you're right. And I'm using them interchangeably and you're absolutely right. I'm not a performer, right? I'm not a performer. I'm no longer performing. I still dance,

Erin:

practice, dance and do dance and love dance, and feel free to bring up the club. Like you are a dancer. That is a dance.

Eric:

Yeah. No, and you're right. I'm using them interchangeably and I shouldn't be I think you can

Erin:

really make your mind believe what you're saying. If you're not careful. So when you tell yourself you're not a dancer, you start to believe it.

Eric:

Yeah. I think I think I think I possibly subconsciously did that too, so that there would just be like the finality to my dance and performance. Cause to me, like for a long time they went hand in hand oh, if I'm going to be dancing and practicing, I might as well put it on stage. So no, but you all or nothing. Yeah. That's my all or nothing but no, you're right. I'm still a dancer. I'm just not a performer anymore. At least not in that realm of performance.

Erin:

Cause I feel when you go to the club you're performing,

Gil:

I never

Eric:

mean to be,

Gil:

gosh, she asked, they put on Janet, I've gone, go get my drink.

Eric:

I think it's important

Erin:

to, to, talk to yourself in the way that you believe yourself to be. I think you're always a dancer and you're

Eric:

right. Yeah.

Erin:

I think, like you said, it is part of your, when you said it used to be dance. So I think it still is, I do think it still is. I think, you're longing to go to the club and dance. That's very much a healing place for you.

Eric:

No, that is a very healing place for me. I just mean I used to be able to I used to put all my emotions into my drilling and then like I would put it into my performances and I, I started to describe myself as more of a, what was it? A movement expressionists and. Because I was just expressing myself through movements, especially towards the end. Cause I just wanted things. I didn't want to have to fit in an actual box of this style and this style. I just want it to move. And so I was doing it to songs that were healing for me. Yeah. And yeah. Yeah.

Erin:

So yeah, I think that's sounds like it's very healing and I love that you brought up the podcast. I feel like that really leads into the next question, which is related to why you guys are doing this, like what inspired you to start a podcast? It's been running for a couple of seasons, so obviously you're doing it. That's no, there's no doubt about that or you wouldn't still be doing it. Reflecting back, do you feel like the podcast. Intentions that you had to begin with are coming to fruition or, what kind of changes has ha had happened along your process?

Eric:

With the podcast, I actually, the podcast is totally different than what I was supposed to be or what I had like originally, initially thought of it. It's totally different. I shouldn't say it's totally different, but it's different enough. It's significantly different. Initially how this whole thing even came to fruition is, was it like three years ago, two or three years ago? Three years ago, three years ago. I was, I had this idea that we needed a panel show, like the view or the talk, but we needed to focus on LGBTQ. Yeah topics. Cause I didn't think there was enough of that in the world. And there's a lot of stuff going on and it's a very marginalized community and I was like, we need to have that. And I called Gil and I was like, we need to do this. And I have a friend who's a lawyer and I have a friend who's this and we can, yeah. Adult entertainer, and we can do this and we can have six people all coming from different angles and perspectives and we can have our talks and discussions. So that was my original an idea. It's hard to get that type of stuff produced for TV expensive, especially when you have no name. And then, so I just it just fizzled out to a degree, like it was still there, but it wasn't, I didn't really think about it much after some realization hit me. Sure. And then when the pandemic hit, I was out of work for six to eight months. Yeah. So I was like, what do I, what am I going to do again? I was like very much, like I have to be busy, I have to do this. I have to be dah. And so I started a t-shirt line. I finalize publishing my book and I started the pocket. I started the podcast and I just did some other projects that I'd been working on or wanting to work on. And so I called Gil again. I was like, so remember when I had that idea about the show and he's yeah, I was like, do a podcast. Yeah. Yeah. And then, so the podcast was going to be very much like we're going to talk about these topics and we're going to have a topic discussion and we're going to do it like that. And I think we do that too. I think we do that, but at one, at some point I was like, you know what? Let's have some fun. And the wake we are, we have a little platform that we're building. Yeah. Let's put other guests on it because then as Gill and I talked, we realized that my story is. Not really like his story. We have aspects that are similar, but they're not the same. And then I know people who've had like addiction problems who we might have one or two aspects that are the same, but I don't know what it's like to have an addiction issue. At least to substances. I have food issues, but Gil may not have food issues, which I know you just said, you do, but or the next person may not have food issues, but they have this issues and this person may have had like a brutal coming out story. And this person had a unicorn on a cloud coming up. Sorry. Yeah. So it was like, we, it, we decided that we wanted to develop a platform, where people could identify with different stories oh, I can relate to this part of this person's story and this part of this person's story. And I can relate to this person's story, or I can totally relate to that person, but I don't relate at all to this person. And that's where it like blossomed in, took off from there. Yeah. Yeah. And we've been really fortunate to have some amazing guests who are willing to go there and share their stories like with HIV status and drug abuse and then racial inequality and injustices that they've faced and yeah, just being marginalized for different reasons. Like we've been really honored to have.

Erin:

So was it mostly your sort of your vision and you just roped Gil in or what?

Eric:

Pretty much you're like,

Erin:

listen, I need a co-host you're in buddy.

Eric:

So here's the thing too. Like me being an introvert, I don't necessarily like public speaking or like talking. I know I chew my face a lot on this podcast, but I really am.

Erin:

So Gaye, how much do you like

Eric:

talking? And Gil and I have this great banter like him and I can talk about nothing for seven hours and still talk about everything. And Gil's also my longest friendship in the LGBTQ community. Like he was obviously just a natural, I guess I should ask

Erin:

that. Or you

Eric:

might've talked about I've talked about it, but we can talk about it again. So it was just a natural fit and Gil and I can, we can talk, like I said, we can talk about anything and everything and nothing. All at the same time we bring out the quote, unquote gayness in each other. Like you've never seen me, so you've never seen me. So flaming as I am with Gil and vice versa. I might've,

Erin:

but the world

Eric:

you may have, but I actually think, I don't think you have you and I are pretty intense when we were together and everyone's yo, like I've never seen y'all act that way. I'm like, it's because I'm here. Yeah.

Gil:

It's so true. Here we go.

Eric:

So yeah, he was just a natural. Thing and plus I don't think anyone wants to hear me talk for an hour to an hour and a half. I know I talked for 45 minutes to an hour and 20 minutes and Gil gets like a good, like five to 10 minutes in, but there's enough of a breakup that it's not just me like chewing my face.

Gil:

No. It's just funny. Cause this is pretty much the only time that I am taking more of a backseat in something. And like I said, I love it. This is the first time I'm like, okay, he wants to take you. Cause normally I'm the one in charge. I'm the one doing the talking and dry. So what Eric's I'm going to take control, go for it, what you need. Yeah. It

Erin:

Works while I talk to you guys. I just pulled the king of wands, as you were talking about that, Eric, which is basically like the trailblazing leader, which is so funny that both like it's circulated into this conversation from both sides, like usually heals the trailblazing leader. And in this case, he's, you're allowing yourself some space to take on a different role, which is, I think always valuable. Contrast. On that note, I'm going to ask Gil a question.

Eric:

Did you want us to talk about how we met?

Erin:

If you've talked about it before, I feel

Eric:

like it doesn't matter. Okay. Yeah. We talked about it in the Amy sigil episode cause she asked us, I

Erin:

was like, as soon as I asked that, I'm like, I feel like this has been covered. So my next question is. You guys talk, you touched on pride and this being pride month in your last episode. And I was hoping to just get a little bit more in depth. Cause I felt it went a bunch of different directions and I didn't get a real quality what pride means to you like personally. And also like I have a couple other follow up questions, but what does it mean to you personally?

Gil:

Yeah, for me, it's definitely, it's a mix of honoring those who came before us to get us the platform that we have. But also it's continuing that tradition. This is the new, this is what they blaze for us. How do I keep it going? And then how do I make sure that, my story's out there, but also somebody who could relate or somebody who may be struggling and that's where I want to make sure I'm out there. Showing them a fellow brown person, I'm over here showing my, true colors and you're okay. You're safe. I may, I'm here for you. You may not know me, but I am always going to be here. I think it's want to make sure that they know that there is a safe space for them maybe not at home, but like I said, that's what pride is for me. So I get offended when I hear a lot of, we don't need it anymore. Sure. And I'm like, are you kidding? Yeah. No, that's not how this works. I love that. Yeah. So that's what pride for on a personal level, because I know I normally give the very managerial response to, at a very, political, but for me, that's what it is. It's a mix of both. The past then. Yeah. Future,

Erin:

I feel like a lot of cards I pull for you are about healing legacy, like legacy healing cards. Yeah. Which is really interesting. And for both of you to pull tens, I've pulled tens a lot, which is really interesting. Cause it's like a, it's like a completion of one cycle. And also it's like a door closing and a door opening kind of feeling like a death and rebirth feeling. So it's like being on the precipice or like at a threshold you've done, you've leveled up to this level and you've completed that level and now you're stepping into the next level. So I really love and then I have a specific question about pride, like how do you, and you can answer at first Gil and then I can ask Eric, but like how do you feel about the participation of non LGBTQ plus. Allies participating in like parades and celebrations. I'm curious as a person who, is a non LGBTQ plus member of the community official, but I just wonder, I know sometimes use those things as an excuse to go party or dress up, which I get, but I'm wondering how you feel about

Gil:

it for me. I like genuinely, I like it. I like people, to me it should be welcoming, but if you're talking about and especially in the sense of leading the charge, no that's where you as an ally of something just like in the, we have the, the Black movement I take the back seat. I don't know the experience of the, as a African-American in the us. Yeah, my experience as a, as another minority is completely different. So in those kind of stuff, I'm like, what do you need of me to help support you? And I think in pride, it's the same thing is that we do need the allies. And I love that the parents, especially our parents are getting involved. My mom, huge advocate and I absolutely adore it and we need them, but I would be a more, a little bit more on the fence of them leading the charge.

Erin:

Dude, look at the card I just pulled while you're talking,

Gil:

it's

Erin:

straight up the king of swords, like Peter with the megaphone and the sword.

Gil:

Yeah. It's still our, our thing, but it's definitely, it's one of those we need as much support as we can and just. It is what it is what it is with that. Yeah. I like it. Like I said, some people get offended. No, it's, don't close the doors. It's more open the door, make the dialogue there. The dialogue needs to be in there. And that's the questions. There's gonna be some questions that, you know, yeah. There are some stupid question, but you don't know, to me, the fact that you're even asking is a gateway of Hey, I want to know, I want to well-round myself. I know what my ignorance, this is what I need. I want to know about XYZ. Ask it. It's okay.

Erin:

Yeah. I think that's, permissioning people to have uncomfortable conversations, where we need to go, to make any real change. Looking down your nose at people who ask a question that, someone else thinks they should know the answer to already, or is whatever, it's uncomfortable. There's. That's the only way to grow, it's to, it's just sit with some discomfort sometimes. Yeah. At least on an evolutionary level. Yeah.

Gil:

Yeah.

Erin:

Not from eating too much grow. Yeah.

Gil:

That's my other. Yes.

Erin:

And then I feel like there's just, what are your thoughts about needing to have a designated month for celebrating marginalized groups? That just in general, what are your thoughts about that? I

Gil:

feel like I know with pride, it's very anniversary. I think it's cause it's stone, Stonewall happened and so they were trying to anniversary it and that's kinda how it became. I'm sure in time you'll be transitioned out for being just June will be, oh, year will be pride or some sort of it for other minority groups. But I just don't want it to become like, oh, okay, now we're transitioning for this. Now we're going to become this. And then you forget about why we're doing X, Y, Z, or why it's really what's the impact for it. And it's, don't want to become another commercialized holiday, which to a degree it is. It's okay, let me make a quick buck, but what are you doing with the money? Is it really impacting the community?

Eric:

That kind of yeah. Or hobby lobby.

Gil:

Yeah. And I think that's where I just want to make sure. Slippery slope with it, where it could get work and get going, or, yeah, I guess I don't want to turn another Coachella. It's not that

Erin:

well, on that note, what was your like favorite pride celebration ever in your existence?

Gil:

Favorite? It actually what am I? It was, I think a couple of years, God it's, since Penn, since the pandemic happened, I'm like all the year seems so forward and I'm like an extra year, just, a few years ago actually was one of my absolutely favorite because a couple of friends from New Mexico flew in. I had a friend from Seattle, it was just like all of us meeting in San Francisco, the Mecca, the granddaddy and it was. It was nice because we were all just us. The masks were off. We were just enjoying the weekend, walking all over the city, owning the place. It was such confidence and no, it was just your soul family was there. This whole family was indeed, it was one of my absolute favorites because most of them I met while I was in college, so it was nice to see him in my hometown, in my area, it's oh, here we go. It was just fine. We're just relaxed. And of course we have, my my good friend Danea, she's like my grace, I would say like your will and grace. Yeah. So she was there, huge ally. And like I said, it was just a very mixed bag group. Randomly together.

Erin:

Cool. Yeah. And then how do you plan, or do you plan to celebrate pride during these pandemic

Eric:

times?

Gil:

Actually I have a friend Micah who's actually flew down from Seattle here, so he came down. Yeah. But next year, Eric will come to the city in 2022 for pride to the Mecca. I will get you this way. Yeah, we'll do a live podcast drunk. Where's Eric. We're at Folsom street right now. Live.

Eric:

I love Folsom

Gil:

street. I know clutch my pearls a little bit for that

Eric:

and wipe them off.

Gil:

God, I

Erin:

love that. Do you, what was your favorite pride ever? Let me start over, Eric, what does pride month mean to you?

Eric:

I, so I do agree that I think a lot of it is paying honor to the trailblazers and those who have made us. So we actually have even a little bit of a platform to fight for our own equality and our own rights. I also think it's. A beautiful time to recognize self recognition and self-acceptance, and self-love, and the journeys into each of those phases. Because when you're in the LGBTQ I a community a lot at the time, it's you have to recognize that, oh, I am not the quote, unquote, same as everybody else. Or I'm quote unquote different than everybody else. And you have to recognize that. And once you recognize that and actually see it for what it is instead of all, oh no, that's not true. Once you recognize it, then you move into the phase of accepting it. Yeah. And so I think when, and that can take a long time, it took me a long time. And once you do, then you start to be okay with it and then you start to just embrace it and love it. So I think it's also a nice reminder. Of your own struggles that you had to do personally, as well as the struggles and the fight that so many before us have endured and went through for us to even have what we have. Yeah. So that's so

Erin:

homage and reflection. That's something. I love that. And what was your favorite pride ever?

Eric:

Oh, and then just really quickly. I also agree with Gil on the allies. I ask about that too. I love our allies. I think we need allies. We need them like fighting for racial justice. We need allies in the majority so that we can still be heard because even though we can make a lot of noise and Queen's gonna make a lot of noise. Okay. A lot of people wouldn't take us seriously until we have the allies from the majority that are actually. Yeah, making that noise with us. My favorite pride, so I've always ended up having to work on pride most of the time. So I've never really been able to partake in a lot of festivities. And I, at some point when I was like, still trying to come to terms with it, or if I was embracing my internalized homophobia or whatever it was, or a combination of the two, I think that sometimes I was like, oh, I have to work. And so that was that. But yeah, but I think my favorite pride was actually my first pride experience when I went to Denver for pride and I liked Denver pride. Yeah. It was really fun. And it was interesting because again, like I'm super shy and introverted unless I'm on a dance floor as you guys alluded to earlier. So like my friends who were that I was with at the time, they were like super outgoing people. And they're like, you would never know that you were the shy one. Cause I found a stage with balloons on it and I was like front and center dancing the whole time. Yeah. Yeah. It's performing if you will. I was performing, but this, the thing is I never intend to perform when I'm dancing at a club. Like I don't think of it as performing. I just, I'm just literally dancing, but I've gotten a lot of shit for a stage

Gil:

for you. I think,

Erin:

I don't think that there needs to be like shame about it. I think. Who you are. And if other people like it, then that's their problem.

Gil:

So actually one of the cool things for me, 2019, it was right before the, a pandemic that pride, my mom and stepfather actually marched in the pride parade in San Francisco. I was so I was overwhelmed with emotion. Oh yeah. That's beautiful. I was so proud of them. I was like, they're like, yeah, we're marching. We're you know, my stepfather works for a winery. They were a sponsor. So that he was the first one sign up. It's yes, I'm going. And I was just like, oh, it's just touching. So that's why I'm hoping any listeners out there don't shoot down your parents. They learn every, they grow, give them,

Erin:

I feel like that really like circles right back to the beginning, like that healing work. Like just having those people show up for you when you

Gil:

never thought they could. I

Eric:

love that.

Erin:

Okay. So I think my last question is about it's a little convoluted. Maybe it will sound fine coming out, you were talking about asking. I don't even think it's an uncomfortable question. It's just a question, but I do feel like asking about pronouns the, how and the when and the why of pronouns and how much they've changed. I think obviously that's a newer generational change that's happening as far as I know, but again, I may be wrong. It just feels like this younger generation is bringing a more sort of gender fluid mainstream experience to the community. And I know. People struggle with that. I think I've struggled with it. I've struggled with it on a couple of different levels and I'm happy to share my struggle with it. Not my pronouns, but the pro the pronouns, the non gendering, the sort of removal of gender altogether. I think there's just so many facets of this. I think pronouns are one of them, but, they, when they, them kind of concept really takes gender out of it all together. And the struggle I've had was like, I'm really, I really love being a woman. And so too, it almost strips that from me those sorts of sayings of the future's genderless. And it's but I like my gender, yeah. Kind of feeling like, whoa, does it have to be all or nothing? I mean it's fluid, right? That's how I see it. But I do have that sense sometimes of feeling like, and that's totally like centering myself and it's my own privilege and problem that happens and I'm working on it but it's true. I have had those thoughts. So I wonder about that. Do you ask, I re I feel like in more public settings, it's becoming more of like a question that's just put out there to begin with. So that's but if you're meeting new people or acquaintances w when do you ask about their pronouns or do you,

Gil:

that, that is something that. I don't know, I personally was trying to wrap my head around myself. And I'm not old, but also it's, I'm not young either. Like I, it just something that I've never, I think cause, but how do we put in the community for the most part, at least the way yeah. Growing up, it was people I'm speaking of, I don't know. We've always referred to each other in a very feminine tone. So it's always been just, she's always been for both men or a woman. And I don't know it just, for me, especially the genderless thing. It's I like the concept of it if it works for you, but I always hated stuff. If they're just getting shoved down your throat, just for the sake. It being politically correct. If this makes sense. It's just

Erin:

because that makes so much sense. I feel like you feel me, you feel seen.

Eric:

Yeah,

Gil:

because like me, I'm proud to be a male. I it's, he that's my term, but if you call me a sheet, I'm not offended either. I'm like, okay. She, I, I'm okay with it, I dunno, I don't take it a very absolute if you identify as whatever, then I will call you that. I don't know. I just don't, but it's always awkward when I ask. Cause I don't want it to be like assuming something. Sure.

Erin:

And I don't think that everybody is down. Do you feel like, obviously you can only speak for yourself and I don't know that all gay men like are down with, Hey

Gil:

girl. Yeah.

Erin:

So Eric, what do you, how do you feel about pronouns? Do you have a etiquette you can share?

Eric:

Yeah. It's something that I don't know. I'm I don't know. I think of, I go at it in two different ways. I've had a few conversations with a few other people too. I typically like introduce myself and then I just give my pronouns because then that just allows for someone to respond with their pronouns. So you're not putting it on them. Hi, my name's Eric. And they introduce themselves and be like, oh, so what are your pronouns? And then they're like all, wait, what? So I was like, hi, I'm Eric. He, him. But I also will go by they them as well. Okay. Although I do identify as male yeah. And again, like Gil said, we do tend to feminize each other sometimes, but no. So that's typically how I will do it. I have though been also that person and I think this is a habit that I'm trying to break, but I haven't completely broken it yet. And I have friends that do this too, where they you'll say you're assumed pronoun, and then once they correct you, then, okay, cool. That will never happen again. I apologize. And yeah, I don't know that you

Erin:

have to apologize though, if you didn't know

Gil:

that. Yeah.

Eric:

I get that, but I think, for me, it's just I'm sorry if there was an offense. Put on you because I didn't ask beforehand or I didn't know beforehand. And maybe that's just me and my own insecurities. That could totally be my own insecurities. Cause I'm as much as I'm trying to break the habit of being a people pleaser, I'm still very much a people pleaser I'm learning. No was one of the greatest and hardest things for me to learn how to do, learning, how to say no. So I and I faltered in that way too, but like I said, once they correct you, then that's it. You go with that. Exactly. You start like going back then you're just being an asshole. Think then you're

Gil:

actively.

Eric:

I feel like there's a

Erin:

learning curve though, too.

Eric:

Now I also think that. We need to be a little bit more patients, because like you said it's, I don't want to say it's a newer thing, but it's something that, but it is yeah.

Gil:

Yeah. And so get off of the high horse about Altruistic Oh, how do you not, it's almost like they're bashing you for them. Like we just learned yeah. A generation away from you. I have no fricking idea.

Eric:

And I agree with that

Erin:

cause like that type of reactivity, when, you can't make a mistake,

Eric:

I don't think that you should hold it against someone if they just like, honestly don't know. And if someone asks you like, like introduces and says hi, my name is and like they introduced themselves and they ask what are your pronouns? Even though it might be like, oh, okay. I wasn't expecting that. They're trying to be respectful and they're trying to honor your pronouns. So I think that we need to be a little bit more willing to give. On that, because it is still a newer thing. And I think that,

Erin:

I think the asking is fine. I think what I'm talking about is like the learning curve of using they and them is,

Eric:

It's, I know a lot of people, I know a lot of people are uncomfortable with the using of the indem because a it's plural automatically

Erin:

really confusing. Grammatically commerically what is that?

Gil:

I am with you on that part, because for me, it's just, it's from the grammatical. I just use their name because I do have a bike. I've worked with a person who went by, they them, and I just use their name in everything it's if I'm referring to them. And I just kept, because it was just, like I said, it's just hard as an, as in a sentence, they who's, they which they,

Eric:

I think. I think I've often used them in day though, to just refer to somebody that I know is like male or female, that's oh, I'm going to their house. I'm going to go hang out with them rather than I'm going to go hang out with her. I'm going to her house kind of thing. So

Erin:

if that's the use, then it's easier. And I find myself practicing. Like you when the person's not there, like when I'm referring to the person and talking to someone else, I make sure to use the pronouns if I am aware of them. And if it's specifically, if they are they them I, I practiced when, as much as I can when

Eric:

they're having conversation. And then I also like one of your earlier comments. I don't, I think it's cool to be very fluid. I love that the younger generation is so fluid, but to be moving to oh, it's completely genderless. I. I'm with you on that. Yeah, it's not. And I think it's I don't know if I want to make this comparison, but I'm going to make it anyways. Like we talk about religion and how I, oh, you have to believe this way. You have to believe this way. I'm this religion person and you need, okay, cool. If your religion works for you, that's awesome. And please have it, but don't force me to live by it. So the same thing, like I think it's awesome that you're non-binary or that you're genderless. That's really cool. That's phenomenal, but don't expect everyone else to have to be gender nonconforming as well, because some of us do identify with our gender and we're proud to, and I think that's totally fine too.

Gil:

I was going to say women are still underpaid. Therefore there's gender. I just, I cannot buy it because as much as I don't believe in color. Fan fucking tastic. But the fact of the day is I will be profiled any shopping mall or my friend who is African-American will be profiled or shot that's that doesn't change. You may not believe it, but it's a thing, I think that's why I have it. It's hard for me to believe. Great. You don't believe in gender maybe in the sense of what you do as a male, as a traditional male or as a traditional female, but at the end of the day, you're still going to be treated as such with the policies

Eric:

out there. Oh, absolutely. We've talked about this, like I've been stopped numerous times and stores and oh, do you need anything? Do you need anything? Can I help you? I'm like, okay, the first couple of times. Cool. But like by the fourth, fifth and six time yo, like I'm either I'm going to buy something or I'm just looking I don't need to follow me around the store. I've been detained at border patrol for an hour and a half. I've been heavily questioned at border patrol on a few other times. Cause I look suspicious. I've been questioned and searched by the TSA at the airports Yeah. And

Gil:

I like being randomly selected, randomly chosen today. I'm

Eric:

like really? And I worked last time too. And I was on the way to my destination and now I'm on my way back from my destination. Okay. Yeah,

Erin:

somehow I never have though

Eric:

weird, right?

Erin:

Just like middle-aged lady over here. Although the tattoos I've definitely been. Looked at, especially in stores for that purpose, but never the airport stuff, but I've definitely been like

Eric:

hooligan, yeah. I had a friend actually who had, who was like, oh, I need to buy this shirt. Cause I guess she came across the shirt online that said, don't worry, my tattoos don't like you either. I was like, that's awesome. And like this, so the thing is like Gil was talking about like with our different experiences. I think it's, that's why these celebrate these months are necessary. Yeah, because as much as we want to say oh, like there's no color in the world, we're all equal. It's great that you have that thought, but it's a very ignorant thoughts. And I'm guilty of having, I was raised like, oh, we're all the same. There's no color. And then I learned that, no, that's not true when, by me saying that I'm invalidating these experiences that these other groups have had. Correct. So I've grown with that.

Erin:

And I also wanted to add I know that Gil, your diva is Annie Lennox who is totally gender fluid. Has that, so there was that wasn't existence and David Bowie comes to mind as well. Who might be my diva? Who name? I didn't even know until right now, but. So I feel like those are the trailblazers, right? The king of Wong that, but it's interesting how I would imagine at least, and this may be not true, but I would imagine that people in the generation like high school age, current high school age, where the gender fluidity, they're the ones upholding they them. And, it's come up in a couple of television shows that I watched this, I also think is really great. And typically it's younger high school age folks blazing that trail. They probably don't even know who Annie Lennox is. Are they paying homage

Gil:

to Yeah.

Eric:

Gill's jaw just hit the floor. When someone said they may not know who Annie Lennox is,

Gil:

but no, it's very true. It's when was it? Eric? Lady Gaga performed at the, was the billboards, which she dressed up as a guy. Oh yeah. I remember they were completely like, oh my God, this is so trailblazing. That was the VMAs. Yeah. Cause Gaga knew who she was imitating or what she did, but the viewers, her fans, young fans had no idea any Lennox did. And the Grammys in 1984. Yes. We've been there. That's what I'm saying. Yeah. No, and that's very true.

Eric:

I don't think Annie Lennox gets half the props she deserves. Like I'm always talking about Janet Jackson being highly underappreciated and especially in the LGBTQ and the dance world and the music world, but Annie Lennox too. Yeah. Oh for sure. Sure. Yeah.

Erin:

Those are the original, gender binary.

Eric:

Yeah. Yeah. They called it gender bending. Yeah.

Gil:

It's insane. Especially back then. It was like a female to do that. Oh my God. Okay. I know

Eric:

I would dare she. Yeah. I think Annie Lennox has done a lot for sure. And she was provocative then, but she was provocative about things that she cared passionately about what she has proven time and time again, of how huge of an ally she is. Correct.

Gil:

And maybe that's what lured me as a kid. I saw that I was like, I was so intrigued with her. I was like, oh my God. Yes, this is all females doing this. Okay.

Eric:

We love those powerful females

Gil:

do I do? And I grew up in a family where my mom's side, they're all strong women. These are strong, independent, opinionated women. My aunts were very, a big force in my family. My life growing up. I always knew women are strong. I didn't know any weak women, just my grandmother, she's in hospice right now, but even then she's still fighting, down to the wire

Erin:

matriarch. The what side? I know you said that

Gil:

you were my Filipino side, so it's my mom's side. Yeah. Yeah. It's a little bit different structured to my father's side where it's very male, the Latino side. It could be very,

Eric:

yeah, that's interesting. Cause like my mom is like the only girl in her family other than like her mother. But so I grew up, like I said earlier with a very like Latin X machismo. It's so interesting to me though that like my mom is such. A fighter and such an assertive, powerful woman in her own. And she'll tell you otherwise, but she's, she is. And that was instilled in me. So like I said, like I'm super pro woman about everything because I always have been because of my mom instilled that into me. Exactly. No one would be alive. There would be no one. Yeah. Honestly, women don't need women don't need men at all because they can just clone themselves. Now men will always need a woman. Yeah. If they want to

Gil:

reproduce if they want to proof it. Yup. No, absolutely. Yeah. I know

Eric:

Nick cannon is having his seventh child. What he just had. He just had twins like a week ago and then his new girlfriend just announced that she's pregnant. So the seven child

Gil:

kids,

Erin:

I feel like that's all I have for questions. I feel like. Good. Final question. I want to ask if you guys have any questions for the cards or if you just want me to pull a card for you to integrate what we've talked about

Gil:

for me pull a card. I like to always be surprised, whatever hard let it happen. Yes.

Erin:

Oh, my God, I love this card so much. So it's

Eric:

the hierphant. Hold on. That's a pretty one.

Gil:

I like that.

Erin:

She or they are a scientist. I feel like. So they hold the keys of knowledge. There's also some old paradigm stuff, which is really interesting that this should come up as your card for integration. It's I feel like I get the sense that most of your answers and most of what you were talking about, most of your healing work and growth work is this trusting your own wisdom about things. Yeah. And this card. And you even said that at the beginning, which is, so I love that this is the card you got, that you're like I was influenced. And then I became the influencer and you really were able to, and the reason was because you trusted your wisdom once. Had a handle on it. Or once you assumed into it. Yeah. And I feel like this card is often seen as like this Pope type figure, like a that's giving the information and that the subjects are learning from them. And that's an old paradigm. So I especially love this deck because they've broken a lot of old paradigms with it. And this is very much you are your own wise teacher. Yes. So I love that for you. Thank you. And then I pull already pulled Eric's unless you have a question.

Gil:

Oh no, no question. Do you have a

Eric:

questionnaire? Oh you can just pull a card for me. I might ask, I might hit you up for a reading though. Later, like off the cast.

Erin:

Okay. I pulled for you the Knight of cups, which I love so much and. What I love so much about this is

Eric:

he looks like me as a little kid posing. He'll be like, let's take a picture and I'd have to pose

Erin:

on the bottom. It says the love song. So I love that very much.

Gil:

Thank you. Like the strip club. I love that song.

Eric:

I have to tell this story. I have to tell this story really quickly. Okay. I took Gill with me to a strip club a female strip club. I loved it. I loved strip. I love strip clubs regardless. And I took Gill with me. I took Gill with me cause we were going to go see a friend of mine. And Gil was sitting there so uncomfortable. Cause there's like all these half naked women and strippers around and he's just oh my God, what do I do? And I'm like still being all like internalized homophobic Eric over here and drinking a beer and like man spreading and being a total asshole. And Gil's like getting his fruity little drink and then love song came on. Oh my God loves him by the cure. I love this song.

Erin:

What's interesting about that is so the nights of the tarot are all about movement and like how you move through the world. And the Knight of cups is all about sort of balance, like not spilling. Yeah. Your cup as you're moving through the world. Okay. So taking those times and spaces for your own, healing or pauses or whatever it is to get more in tune. And I love that at the top of this, I pulled the king of cups for you. I just love that. I think it's such a, it's a really powerful connection between those two. I'm just going to pull one to integrate our conversation here. Strange. Oh, I love this. This is the first card I saw when I got out my, so it's the hermit. Yeah. Which is all about the present moment and also about movement, but in a different way, it's where, the light inside of the lantern is supposed to represent like the star light, the healing light of the star. And it's your inner, like your inner star, your inner healing light. And because of lantern, how a lantern just lights up, maybe a step or two in front of you. It's not like a floodlight where you can see way into the future or even way behind you. So it's really about taking your time one step at a time and really just being present in the

Eric:

moment. I love that. I

Gil:

love it.

Erin:

Good

Gil:

cards, gray cards, especially being like being present in the moment. I think that's something that we, especially the pandemic slowed us down. It really, I felt like it forced us to really look. In the moment to day, because my, before I was like, oh, I'm mapping out the next five years. And then had that bucket. I edited, went up in flames.

Eric:

I've said it many times. Like I've, it was so healing for me because it forced me to really look at looking at myself and what cycles I hadn't broken. Yeah. Gave me strength to at least acknowledge that. And now I'm trying to break cycles that I hadn't already broken.

Erin:

Yeah. Yeah. And there were a lot of tens that came up and like I was saying, those are just that death rebirth, like the, just being on the threshold of that. And I feel now that we've had such an extended period of time in a space where all we could really do was be present. Maybe we can carry that

Eric:

forward.

Gil:

Yes. Yeah.

Erin:

And scene just

Eric:

kidding. Thank you so much, Erin, for flipping the script with us. Thank you for being with us and pulling some cards and offering your insight and asking questions that we may not have ever asked ourselves or addressed and asking us like more in depth questions. Cause I know a lot of times we like to just brush over the surface. So I really appreciate that. Erin, really quick question. Is there any way that we can get ahold of you for a tarot readings?

Erin:

Yes. So I'm both on the Facebooks and the Instagrams and my business is called hermit and the moon. So Instagram at hermit underscore. And underscore the underscore moon.

Eric:

Awesome. Love that. And we'll also link that up in the show notes as well. Yes. Thank you Gil for showing up. Thank you all for listening to us. Again, we'll be on hiatus for a couple months, but we will be back in September.

Gil:

Happy pride, everyone

Eric:

happy, pride and We look forward to being with each and every one of you and thank you so much.

Gil:

thank you for listening to us. We hope you enjoyed your time in The Q Lounge. If you have any questions, comments, suggestions on topics, or if you would like to be a guest or contributor, please email us info.TheQlounge@gmail.Com or through our contact page at theqloungepodcast.com. Don't forget to subscribe to continue listening wherever you get your podcasts. If you want to be our sugar, daddy hit that donation button.

Eric:

Until next time live in your authenticity.